Martha Shelley interviews Gene Damon aka Barbara Grier, founder of the lesbian magazine The Ladder (1956-1972). They discuss the beginnings of The Ladder and how it evolved from a smaller publication within the Daughters of Bilitis (DOB) into an independent publication. Grier discusses the shift in content as well once the magazine became independent of the Daughters of Bilitis. Grier felt that under DOB they were focused on presenting a clean public image of lesbians to society at large and that this was reflected in what was published in older versions of The Ladder. Once Grier became the editor, she felt it was important to address topics like sexuality, saying “we began running material that deals with sex honestly and forthrightly.”
At the start of the interview, Andy talks about the first time someone asked her about sex. She talks about her experience going with hookers. She discusses butches and femmes and argues that femmes aren't "true" lesbians.